Batman Begins question...

[neotoma]

For all of you who have seen the movie, there is one little bit of dialogue that is bothering me.

Towards the end of the movie, after Bruce has insulted everyone into leaving, he confronts Ra's al Ghul

Who says: "You burned down my home and left me for dead. Consider us even."

Under what definition does Bruce's hauling of Henri Ducard's oversized carcass out of the burning temple, back up over a cliff edge, and down a mountain to leave him in the care of villagers in the foothills count as 'left for dead'?

Yes, Ducard/al Ghul was unconscious at the time, but he's not a stupid man. He's also not one who allows himself that kind of illusion. So what the heck is going on there?

It bothers me especially because if Ra's al Ghul hadn't crashed Bruce's party, Batman wouldn't have shown up to spoil the plan with the microwave emitter. He'd have been tucked up in the manor keeping up his Bruce Wayne, Millionaire Playboy cover until the police reports started coming in.

Oh, and the answer that Bruce completely flubbed? To the question, "But is Ra's al Ghul immortal?"

Is:

Yes!

Geez, Bruce, read up on the villians out there. He's only been kicking around for a few of centuries, the crazy Malthusian eco-terrorist.

Comments

[temve.livejournal.com]

Under what definition does Bruce's hauling of Henri Ducard's oversized carcass out of the burning temple, back up over a cliff edge, and down a mountain to leave him in the care of villagers in the foothills count as 'left for dead'?

I read that as Ducard taking into consideration what Bruce did to the 'real' Ra's al Ghul, i.e. the person he thought was the big boss and his leader at the time. And there's no denying that Bruce left him for dead in the burning house... but then, Ra's is something of a hive brain to me anyway and may well consider the two persons (him and his decoy) extensions of one personality.

Interestingly enough, the children's storybook version cuts out that line completely and replaces it by having Ducard/Ra's say to Bruce, "Rest easy, friend."

Which is extra-slashy of course...

[neotoma.livejournal.com]

And there's no denying that Bruce left him for dead in the burning house

Well, Bruce actually left *that* person dead -- fixed, glassy eyes and all -- and went to save who he could, which was the friend he had knocked silly in the first place.

I suppose you could argue that it's been so long since Ducard had compassion directed at him that he had a hard time understanding it...

Which is extra-slashy of course...

And how!

[temve.livejournal.com]

suppose you could argue that it's been so long since Ducard had compassion directed at him that he had a hard time understanding it...

*snort* Hadn't evne thought of it that way - excellent.

Or maybe he rationalises that Bruce, his creature Bruce, could not possibly have degraded him with compassion. Hmmm... someone pleeeease write this, because I'm mired in enough B/D as it is!

[neotoma.livejournal.com]

Or maybe he rationalises that Bruce, his creature Bruce, could not possibly have degraded him with compassion.

My reading of Ra's al Ghul, from the movie and from the other sources, is that he's very VERY good at cold logic and hard choices, but gets a bit thrown by people when they do something irrational and self-sacrificing. He doesn't expect people to turn down power, and he doesn't expect people to be unselfish.

[smaragdgrun.livejournal.com]

I definitely agree that (Liam) meant that Bruce left (R.A.G.) to die. And Liam *was* R.A.G., just Bruce didn't know it at the time...

It was a tricky line and a tricky revelation, and the best part of the movie for me was that they didn't hit you over the head with it, and that Bruce figured it out at the same time it was just as subtly revealed to the audience. I loved watching his face and wondering what the hell was coming next; I thought the timing was really fabulous in that whole scene; hell, the whole movie!

[josanpq.livejournal.com]

Not really commenting as those above seem ot have done a good job of it.

Just want to say, it was a great movie, but it needed more Batman(or Bruce Wayne) skin.

[neotoma.livejournal.com]

What, the "Bats are nocturnal!" scene wasn't enough for you?

Okay, it was a bit on the quick side...

[dphearson.livejournal.com]

Ras Ghul was being an utter asshole, is what. He's a murdering terrorist, is what, and he was miffed that Wayne delayed his plans.

[neotoma.livejournal.com]

He's a murdering terrorist, but he's not a *stupid* one.