Head of Slytherin during the first rise of Voldemort

[neotoma]

In writing Harry Potter fic, I've had a bit of trouble pinning down what the Head of Slytherin could have been like during the first rise of Voldemort.

Obviously, we don't know this person's name, position at school, or anything other than a notably large group of their students went to Voldemort in 1970's.

I can't see Dumbledore tolerating a Slytherin Head who was recruiting for the Dark Lord, either openly or covertly, so I'm left wondering whether the Slytherin Head was just not paying attention, or overwhlemed by the circumstances?

Also, what do you think happened to the previous Slytherin Head of House -- after all Snape is extremely young to be Head of House, and has apparently been Slytherin Head for several years by the time Harry shows up in 1991. Was Snape given Slytherin House at the same time he was hired -- unlikely normal circumstance, but possible if the previous Head was killed -- or did he take over sometime in the 1980s from a retiring predecessor?

Comments

[alchemine.livejournal.com]

I don't know -- Dumbledore is notorious for either not being aware of unpleasant activities going on in the school, or for allowing them to continue for reasons of his own. He might very well have had a Slytherin head who was loyal to Voldemort, in which case the head could have been one of the people who either ended up in Azkaban or quietly disappeared to avoid punishment after Voldemort lost power. I don't think Snape would have taken over directly from the departing, though -- maybe there was an interim head for a few years, and then that person retired.

On the other hand, it's just as possible that the Slytherin head was a perfectly decent man or woman who had been overstressed by all the Dark Lord shenanigans and left teaching for a peaceful cottage in the countryside!

[neotoma.livejournal.com]

Dumbledore is notorious for either not being aware of unpleasant activities going on in the school, or for allowing them to continue for reasons of his own.

The idea that Dumbledore might be willing to give up on a quarter of his students right off the bat chills me deeply. If I take that as what happened, I'd have to fully support the 'Dumbledore is Evil' idea.

He might very well have had a Slytherin head who was loyal to Voldemort, in which case the head could have been one of the people who either ended up in Azkaban or quietly disappeared to avoid punishment after Voldemort lost power.

Hmmm. I hope we learn more in HBP, but doubt it.

[lilly-rose.livejournal.com]

I think you might be giving Dumbledore a bit too much credit? He's not infallible; he says so himself. I don't think he can possibly know everything going on all the time. I do find it plausible that the Head of Slytherin at the time could have been in on it; we're a crafty bunch and famous for it, after all.

Presuming they weren't in on it, I would guess the then Head of the Snake House was simply overwhelmed. I can't see any Head of a House renounced for sneakiness not being on his/her guard a all times

Working on the idea that the Head was clueless/innocent about the mass movement of Slyth students to the Dark Side? I think the previous Head retired somewhere in the mid eighties- old age or boredom.

[neotoma.livejournal.com]

He's not infallible; he says so himself. I don't think he can possibly know everything going on all the time.

But actively recruiting for the Dark Lord at Hogwarts? Wouldn't that have been a little too blatant for Dumbledore to have missed? Especially since teenagers can't keep their mouths shut for beans.

[ataniell93.livejournal.com]

You're forgetting the same thing everyone forgets.

The period when the MWPP were at Hogwarts wasn't very much like the current period, canonically, despite all the stories that are written with a tone and flavour not so different from the present day. According to Rowling, I believe Voldemort was in power for some eleven years.

It may have been all that Albus could do to keep the school open to muggleborns.

[neotoma.livejournal.com]

Voldemort was 'in power' for 11 years in 1981. That means he first rose in 1970, the year before the Marauders and Snape went to Hogwarts. I think their first year might have been tense and with the adults worried, but with the kids oblivious.

At the end, yes, Albus might have been hard pressed to keep the school open to Muggleborn, or open at all, but at the beginning the paranoia wasn't that great.

[bethbethbeth.livejournal.com]

Doesn't Snape tell Umbridge that he's been head of House for 14 years in OotP (I don't have the books on my at the moment)? If that's the case, then it coincides exactly with James and Lily being killed, and that timing suggests to me that the previous head of Slytherin may very well have had something to do with the Death Eaters (either in support or in opposition).

Re: Dumbledore not tolerating a Slytherin Head who was recruiting for the Dark Lord, well...ordinarily I'd agree, but then again he "tolerated" a Defense teacher who *was* the Dark Lord (for all intents and purposes). Dumbledore's either not omniscient or his cunning plans are *way* too cunning for me to figure out. *g*

[neotoma.livejournal.com]

He told Umbridge that he'd been teaching for 14 years. I suspect he was Head of House for the 7 years that Slytherin won the House Cup, so 7 plus the 5 years Harry's been at school is only 12 years for Snape to be Head of Slytherin.

Dumbledore's either not omniscient or his cunning plans are *way* too cunning for me to figure out.

One of my dear friends says I'm too logical to figure out what Dumbledore is doing. The Headmaster's decisions definitely do not resemeble earth logic, and some times I think he's the most emotionally dense character in the series, and given that *Snape* and *Harry* are in it, that is saying a lot.

[bethbethbeth.livejournal.com]

some times I think [Dumbledore]'s the most emotionally dense character in the series, and given that *Snape* and *Harry* are in it, that is saying a lot.

LOL! You know, there's really no way to disagree with this assessment. *g*

[velyrhorde.livejournal.com]

I suspect he [Snape] was Head of House for the 7 years that Slytherin won the House Cup,

YAY!!!! Snape as Successful Coach!!! *digging around for pom-poms*

And there's one of the reasons - that most people overlook, in fact - why Snape resents Harry so much. The blasted child has taken the Cup away from his Slytherins!!

[allectofromlj]

One of my dear friends says I'm too logical to figure out what Dumbledore is doing. The Headmaster's decisions definitely do not resemeble earth logic,

Are you familiar with the Knight-to-King theory? I think it's completely not canon, myself, but one of the greatest things in its favor to me is that Dumebledore would have to act the way he does because he knows that's how he acted.

Which is, obviously a bit like the problem of causality, which is always an issue with time travel, but, then, that's nearly always an issue.

[amberdiceless.livejournal.com]

I'm guessing the same person who was Head of House during the Marauders era probably continued in that same capacity for a while after Snape took over as Potions teacher, but probably retired before too terribly long. If (s)he was a Death Eater or collaborator, they may have got flushed out during the post-Godric's Hollow purge--practically every Slytherin who went through Hogwarts during those years probably knew. If not, being Head of Slytherin during the war years (not to mention the Marauders' tenure!) would be enough to wear anyone out.

Myself, I randomly slapped the name Argyle on the guy and made him a real piece of work...not necessarily evil, but supremely cold and un-sympathetic. McGonagall loathed the man, and I picture Snape not getting along with him either, as a student or a teacher, as his policy was "Anyone who causes Slytherin to lose face by allowing a Gryffindor to get the better of him had better not come crying to me." No canon support whatsoever, of course, that's just my own take on it.

I don't imagine a large turnover in Heads of House--it can't be easy finding people qualified for both a teaching position and the added responsibility of House Head--so I don't see anybody holding the position in the interim, though of course I could be wrong. Since Dumbledore seems to have great faith in Snape, for whatever reason, he may have pulled a lot of strings to install him as Head of Slytherin despite his youth. Or there may not have been a lot of choices available, if a lot of the talented adult Slytherins were jailed or on the run.

[neotoma.livejournal.com]

If not, being Head of Slytherin during the war years (not to mention the Marauders' tenure!) would be enough to wear anyone out.

Well, in the one idea I've had for the Marauders' era Slytherin Head (http://www.livejournal.com/users/neotoma/11498.html), she is a perfectly nice, ferociously practical woman who just can't manage with everything going to hell in a handbasket. She does try, but I think the strife that seeped into from the Muggle world would have made trying to keep students away from the Dark Lord like trying to bail out the ocean.

Or there may not have been a lot of choices available, if a lot of the talented adult Slytherins were jailed or on the run.

Especially since there don't seem to be a lot of staff anyway, given the apparent size of the school (approx. 400 students). There are only two teachers that I'd say are Slytherins, and Snape is the only canonical one.

But yes, there seems to be a whole 'missing' generation with the Snape and the Marauders at the tail end, and going back to people at least Molly and Arthur Weasley's age. Former Slytherins who could be found to teach might have been very thin on the ground.

[arclevel.livejournal.com]

There are only two teachers that I'd say are Slytherins, and Snape is the only canonical one.

And the other?

I could see this going several ways. My suspicion is that the Head of Slytherin was someone who didn't fight for his/her students as hard as he should have or know how to help them, but wasn't actively recruiting for Voldemort or being horrid to them. For instance, I'd hope that the Head would know about the Snape-Shrieking Shack incident, and if so, I think Snape probably would have seen his Head as not standing up for him enough, given that Sirius et al escaped punishment, in his opinion. Of course, it's possible that the Slytherin Head didn't know, as I don't think we ever heard whether or not *McGonagall* heard. Additionally, he could have fought for Snape, but been flatly overruled, but I don't know that Snape would have seen it that way.

Unfortunately, this is the only incident we know of that the Marauder-era Head would likely have dealt with. We can guess something similar from the fact that so many of them went to Voldemort -- perhaps many of them were disillusioned with what they experienced at Hogwarts, and their Head of House did nothing to combat that disillusionment or give them the care and respect they needed. Though, given the Wizarding World's disdain for mental health, it's perhaps hard to say what their Head could or would have done.

I've seen multiple fics where the House Head believed all his/her charges to be Death Eaters in Training, and it became a self-fulfilling prophecy as he tried to keep them in line. I've seen it done well, and I can almost see Dumbledore hiring someone like that and not realizing until too late how badly it was backfiring, but overall I find it a bit implausible. Hence my preferred description as distant and not knowing when they really need help, either directly or interceding with Dumbledore.

This, BTW, is closely tied to my theory that being Head of Slytherin is the one part of his job that Snape actually *likes.* While he's probably not doling out hugs and cocoa to homesick firsties, I suspect he'll fight to no end for them if he feels they're actually in danger or being thrown to the Gryf -- er, wolves. So to speak, of course.

[neotoma.livejournal.com]

And the other?

Sinistra, the Astronomy Mistress. Her name is the name of Ophiuchus Nu (http://www.winshop.com.au/annew/Sinistra.html), one of the stars in the constellation of Ophiuchus (http://www.astro.wisc.edu/~dolan/constellations/constellations/Ophiuchus.html), the Serpent Bearer. It's perfect JKR wordplay.

Of course, it's possible that the Slytherin Head didn't know, as I don't think we ever heard whether or not *McGonagall* heard.

It is a big question if McGonagall knew or not. She seems to be extremely fair in the books, yet speaks very fondly of James, Sirius, and Peter in PoA.

I think she didn't know. And that the Slytherin Head didn't know. If Dumbledore handled it himself, and didn't tell either of the Heads, that would explain how it seems that Snape didn't get satisfaction over the incident.

I suspect he'll fight to no end for them if he feels they're actually in danger or being thrown to the Gryf

I think that's where he's actually quite good at the job. We can debate all day over whether he's a good teacher, but there is no doubt that he's a conscientious one, especially when it comes to student safety and his Slytherins.

[iibnf.livejournal.com]

Perhaps the post is traditionally taken by assassination, like the Popehood, and Snape is particularly ambitious and good with poisons.

[mctabby.livejournal.com]

Or perhaps Slytherins have a tradition of sleeping their way to the top, and Young Snape was the best shag Previous!Head of Slytherin ever had.

[velyrhorde.livejournal.com]

mctabby!!! You made me snort coffee out my ears!!!

*slinks off to write Sleeping-to-the-top!Snape fic*

[rosefyre.livejournal.com]

Here from the Snitch.

Who says Dumbledore hired the last head of Slytherin? After all, he became Headmaster not too long before Lupin started Hogwarts (what this means is debatable, but I think we can safely say that it's after Lupin was bitten and at least enough time to talk to the Lupin parents beforehand, so...sometime between about 1965 and 1970) and Snape started teaching in 1981, I believe. Thus, it's extremely likely that Dippet, or another Headmaster in between Dippet and Dumbledore, hired the head of Slytherin, and thus it's extremely possible that that person was a Death Eater. Dippet doesn't strike me as very intelligent, to be honest.

[neotoma.livejournal.com]

Dippet doesn't strike me as very intelligent, to be honest

Because he was duped by a 16-year-old Tom Riddle? Don't blame him to badly for that -- Riddle was slick.

[rosefyre.livejournal.com]

I agree that Riddle was slick, but I honestly wouldn't expect Dippet to notice that he'd hired a Death Eater...especially if he was no longer Headmaster by the time Voldemort really rose to power. Also, he could have hired someone who wasn't a Death Eater, but then became one.

I've seen some very interesting theories as to who the head of Slytherin was at that time (though a lot of them have been AU since OotP came out), but I'm honestly not certain.

[lynnet.livejournal.com]

I don't think the Head's have all that much control over their students. As I recall the interactions Harry et al have with McGongall occur mostly when they're in trouble, and for one short career conference. There is only so much influence you can exert by punishing people. I would imagine that older students and parents had a far greater influence on the Slytherin behavior than their head of house did. Of course, I've always found the house system slightly suspect. I can't imagine anyone being able to con 400 rebellious teenagers into falling for it. When you consider that many of the punishments meted out are merely taking away points, am I the only person who finds it slightly suspect that not one person, upon losing a bunch of points thinks to say, "aw they're only points, who cares?"

[neotoma.livejournal.com]

You have to remember that Harry doesn't trust authority, and doesn't seek out McGonagall because of it.

Hermione, on the other hand, had no trouble going to McGonagall to get the Time-Turner arranged in her third year.

McGonagall may rarely come into the Gryffindor Common Room, but I think she's quite open if the students come to her.

Of course, I've always found the house system slightly suspect.

Well, I think it's slightly silly, but it is the way British boarding schools are traditionally arranged.

am I the only person who finds it slightly suspect that not one person, upon losing a bunch of points thinks to say, "aw they're only points, who cares?"

I suspect if anyone thinks that, it's someone in Ravenclaw. It is a practice that only works well with peer pressure and team competativeness ensuring that the students care about the points.

via daily_snitch

[jollityfarm.livejournal.com]

I think the thing about the heads of house is that they probably have a lot on their plate. There might be bullying or whatever, but they probably have a lot of that to see to, plus the regular teaching. One might miss important things just because there were so many other things that might well have been of immense importance or seemed that way at the time. It's fairly standard. We didn't have houses in our school, but we had heads of year and it was generally accepted that one couldn't be so hands-on once they were promoted to that position.

My Slytherin head of house (from some time in the 1960s to some time in the 1980s) wasn't recruiting for the Death Eaters, but he wasn't exactly loyal to Albus either (nurturing one or two grudges from his schooldays). He was at school with Tom Riddle but didn't get along with him - or anyone else, really. He didn't like most of the students in his house, never mind any of the others in the rest of the school. Oddly, he quite liked Severus, although he admits to not having paid enough attention to how far in with the Death Eaters Severus and his friends actually were. He admits to being selfish and doesn't care if people think he's a coward. His upbringing, in which he was beaten by his mother for telling lies, ensures that to the present day he will always tell the truth even if the truth is deeply insensitive or certain to piss people off.

His subject was Astronomy and he was variously loved and loathed. He had a lot of charisma, but was also prone to giving certain students nicknames and singling them out in class. He and Severus became closer friends once Severus left the Death Eaters and eventually began teaching at Hogwarts.

I do have to develop him a bit more, but I think he's a great character (in my head).